But the system comes back on again every time you restart the car. I'm getting the message that emission system has a leak. Stupid as it gets. I interpret it as saying that you cannot remove the switch. I bought my vehicle and the switch doesn't work. The auto start/stop is designed to be fully automatic, should not require any additional input from the driver other than moving your foot from the brake pedal to the gas pedal. Stop-start reduces the grams of gases emitted per mile driven. Use less fuel with Auto-Start-Stop. If it isn’t available to them, they have to earn a higher EPA average and that is now getting very hard to improve upon without spending money. Finally, if you really don’t like the technology, then get into the routine of turning it off with the button on the center console everytime you start the vehicle. I'm not really bothered as I think it is a nuisance anyway but just curious if anyone else has had any problems with it.  Thanks. You can turn the stop-start system off altogether by using a button on the dashboard or near the steering wheel if you find it irritating. It is NOT an emissions control device. These are corporations who act on a much larger scale than just you me and our local mechanic. Have your vehicle checked by an authorised dealer. When you go to dealer for service, reconnect the connector and no one's the wiser. Here are a few things you should know: Auto Start Stop will not shut your engine off at every stop if the engine is still warming up. Let us be clear here that this story is not meant to cast the EPA in a poor light. We all used to be told that frequent starts and stops wear out engines more than anything. The individual systems in a vehicle are not the "EPA reg." For more information on our Lincoln auto stop-start disable devices, contact us today. 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Don’t expect coverage if you’ve tampered with the vehicle’s stop-start system. NO AUTO STOP START. Also, any loose vacuum hoses may cause a rough running engine. Ford KA Start/Stop - Can you turn it off? It seems pretty clear that tampering with the emissions controls is a no-no regardless of who does it. If you take 2 exact same cars, side by side...one driver uses the start/stop, but drives it like they stole it, the other turns the start/stop off but drives it like a little old lady going to church. The system works automatically but you can turn it off, if you wish. There are really two main ways that a vehicle will not start. I own the car and am not going to put up with an annoying system that some mechanics are claiming resorts in premature wear to several components - including timing belts/chains. We have Auto Zone, Advance Auto, and O'Reillys in the area that will check for stored codes. You may also disengage the Start-Stop system by checking the box in the Driver Interface screen, under “Settings”. Stop-Start Engines - Can you turn it off? So the ultimate purchaser can legally do anything they want to the system. It is NOT ILLEGAL to modify your car or sell modifications for cars that REDUCE THEIR FUEL ECONOMY. The EPA is not one to f with. I know the stop/start will only work when certain conditions are met etc, my question is a simple one... is it turned on automatically on starting the engine or do you have to turn the dial? Our guess in this situation is that the EPA would take notice. Thanks! It does have the ability to disable start stop option for you. For one, almost every car or truck with this system gives you the option to disable the auto start-stop function temporarily by pressing a button. We asked the EPA if it was legal to do so. I'm not advocating for these, I'm reporting on them. Always remember anyone can post on the MSE forums, so it can be very different from our opinion. When the auto-start-stop indicator flashes amber, shift into neutral or press the clutch pedal. There are a variety of ways to turn off the auto stop-start system on your vehicle. VW did it recently. This model has the auto-stop/start feature for the engine when you come to a stop (at a red light, etc.) But I hate that feature and would like to hear of ways to permanently turn it off after a purchase. I went by Auto Zone once for this service. "..any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine." Cars with stop-start use special batteries that can withstand constantly starting an engine. It would seem to me that if there is a possible Clean Air Act from turning off the system that the manufacturer is complicit by installing a temporary shut off. We asked the EPA if disabling a stop-start system would be considered a violation of the Clean Air Act or any other environmental regulation. When you stop at traffic lights or your car is idling in a queue, this technology can automatically switch off the engine while still supplying power to essentials like the headlights, air-conditioning, radio and the Ford SYNC system. This may have been run by the EPA when chasing CAFE, but the fact it can be disabled by the driver during the drive does not make it a binding EPA system like a catalytic converter. **how** is it illegal? What should I do. Sure, some car makers allow you to turn it off. That sounds like a Class Action lawsuit to me. They designed the system so that Auto-Start stop can only be disabled by manually pressing the auto-start stop button at the beginning (or during) your current trip. System logic shuts off stop/start if the hood is open, so you "trick" it. WHAT THE HELL IS THE DIFFERENCE? Total BS and al it does is make the tree huggers feel better about them selves. 3) A Dealer Offers to Disable Your Stop-Start System O2 sensor needs replacement? The computer knows the battery’s most important job is ensuring the engine starts. - Collos25 : Why have a car with SS there is even a switch to turn the system off but that thats not good enough,the OP wants to mess about with the ECU program I suppose its takes all sorts.Why not permanantly switch off the ESP and ABS while your at it. It is totally legal for manufacturers to sell cars without idle stop systems and it is totally legal for you to disable it. At least on my 2018 Ford F150 I have a switch to deactivate it but I have to select it every time I start up the engine. For city drivers, it could be as high as 10%*, if you spend a lot of your driving time in idle. report. You may also turn the S-S off with ForScan. You get in the car, start it, HIT THE DISABLE BUTTON......and VOILA! 67% Upvoted. On a 50 degree morning the stop start kicks in after about 3 to 4 blocks, warmer days and it kicks in at the end of my driveway. I brought it back to dealer and they say nothing is wrong with my car. Unfortunately it caused expensive engine repairs - so I and every Ody owner I know have installed devices that disable the VCM system. share. When the brake is applied and the vehicle is stopped, the engine temporarily turns off and automatically restarts as the brake is released. Because the switch is not "latching." save. This article is written with the assumption that you are looking for a way to get your Ford Ka started now, and is meant to provide you with practical advice to help aid in the diagnosis.. I have the stop start function on my Ka, although I nearly always turn it off, but if I do leave it on it isn't working. After three days of consideration of the question here is the answer we received: “The EPA generally does not allege conduct to be illegal unless and until the agency has developed a factual basis and decided to pursue an enforcement action. And you come to this conclusion how? Auto Stop/Start Technology. By VIN. This is why we are going to tell you how to turn off the screen of your Ford Ka. If you prefer to see it as a gimmick that's cool with me. The Auto Stop-Start or Engine Stop-Start (ESS) vehicle feature is designed by manufacturers to improve fuel economy while a vehicle is at rest. You can always turn off the switch anytime you start your car, but if you feel it is too much of a burden, then you should apply some of the methods spoken about. After billions in fines and even jail sentences we thought we’d never hear anyone try that again. Plus even if an EPA bureaucrat claimed it was illegal to over-ride - WHO CARES?! I and thousands of other Ody owners installed devices which prevents the VCM system from engaging and we couldn't give a. We will see where it goes. Or maybe your battery needs checking. BUT.....you can't permanently disable it? The vehicle's emissions system is certified as a whole by the EPA. In the meantime, everything else still wor… We also specifically asked for some guidance on individual owners working alone, a local mechanic who charges to perform a stop-start disable service, a company that provides an override product for sale, and an official new car dealership offering such a product or service. I will defeat the start/stop in my 2020 Terrain Denali......until I do I just put it in L9 and the start/stop does not happen. Step back and look at this and see how it may become law at some point, but is NOT law now. Stop-start reduces emissions. If you did and then the engine started running badly, it could be the gas. I was wondering if it might be because I hardly use it or what other causes it might be. The new Ford Ranger that just came out, well it has an automatic defeat for the stop/start when the truck is in 4 wheel-drive mode or when pulling a trailer....per Ford's own add copy. Certainly not a green light to go ahead and defeat that stop-start. Once the driver puts pressure on the accelerator, then the engine turns back on. This thread is archived. If that is the case, a trailer that adds weight, stupid wings that increase drag or stickier tires that increase rolling resistance would be illegal. Some of us don't blindly obey every inane regulation that comes out. Some are mechanical, some electrical in nature. Here’s our guess as to what would happen in three specific groups of scenarios:1) A Vehicle Owner Disables The Stop-Start System On Their Own Turns off engine then turns back on so I can turn it off again because I am parking. Good luck! Auto STOP START.....is just a CHEAP way for the manufacturers of loose engines to meet EPA guidelines....sort of. We have heard many ways to disable the stop-start systems in today’s new vehicles. EPA and the Clean Air Act and I do not like this feature and would like to permanently disable it. We seriously doubt any would be bold enough to do this, but if they did, we’d expect a confrontation with some agency to germinate. These gimmicks help enable the availability of V8 powertrains in cars like the Chevy Camaro and Mustang GT. Because you are using the engine for less time overall, cars with stop-start have lower claimed fuel consumption and CO2 emissions than those without. Also anything else I should know before I buy one? An example of Auto Start-Stop technology at work might be when you're sitting in a drive-thru waiting for a burger. We’ll just have to agree to disagree, John. Around here they do it for free. Auto Start Stop System Amber. It is a gimmick for two reasons: 1) When a vehicle isn't running it produces no emissions, and 2) It uses no gas, which refers us back to reason 1. Obviously however the vehicle was certified by the EPA means that you cannot defeat any of those emission features. Other Reclaiming: Mortgage Fees, Council Tax etc, Pensions, Annuities & Retirement Planning, Report Holiday Deals, Bargains & Special Offers, Martin's Blogs & Appearances & MoneySavingExpert in the News. WE'RE BEING DUPED.....AGAIN. I have bought a 2012 Ford Ka Edge, with stop/start. However, we are not EPA experts. I suspect grandma will still have enough gas to get the gas station in the next town while the other is sitting on the side of the road......out of gas. EPA's Opinion On Stop-Start Disabling Legality We reached out by both e-mail and phone. My opinion. the difference is so insignificant its ridiculous. Do note, while we always aim to give you accurate product info at the point of publication, unfortunately price and terms of products and deals can always be changed by the provider afterwards, so double check first. In total, seven employees of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency joined the communication chain. I disabled mine and wrote to the EPA. GM by 2020 will have a non defeat start stop which you cannot override. With regard to a start/stop system, for example, before alleging any violation the EPA would need to determine first whether the manufacturer of the vehicle in question used the start/stop system to comply with the applicable regulations concerning emissions. To use their button each time I start it is crazy.. My obdmx now loses connection as soon as I turn off the key, when before, it would stay on until the car went to sleep, hence my thinking they did an update. The screen of your Ford Ka remains lit when you drive at night, but this is sometimes annoying. It's an engine/fuel saving behemoth that will make you glad you bought a model with its useful capabilities. It is a fuel economy feature that is neither mandated by the government nor affect your exhaust gas composition in any way. Where there is a will there is a way. Conclusion: Is It Against the Law To Disable Your Stop-Start System? On GM's if you pull the connector that is in line with the hood latch sensor, it disables STOP/START. That benefit cosses you about $150 bucks for the module. Tampering with the emissions control systems once a vehicle is certified for sale is a big deal. It can be very frustrating when a vehicle won’t start.There are many different issues that can cause the problem. To determine whether conduct amounts to illegal tampering or whether an aftermarket product is an illegal defeat device, the EPA would first need to investigate whether each element of the statutory prohibition has occurred. If the outside temperature is too hot or too cold, or if … They will never know I did it. Starting system problems? 1 comment. Doubtful. hide. Auto Start-Stop remains one of the most innovative features on new and even used Ford models (contact us to see which models have this feature activated). John Goreham can be followed on Twitter at @johngoreham. Having a device that automatically switches it to off each time is fine so long as the switch is still intact and functioning. But when a system clearly has safety issues, causes undo hardware failures, or causes mental anguish, the system should be illegal itself, and there should be a way to permanently disable it. In my state of Massachusetts, if a code is found and relates to the emissions system the inspection is a fail. There are ways to permanently disable stop-start systems. So we asked the EPA experts. Vehicle emissions are measured by the EPA in grams produced per mile driven. Is your check engine light on? No more annoying Start/Stop in stop and go traffic! Legality is. It tells me if something is wrong with the vehicle. In addition, some vehicles, trims or options you select may not qualify for A/Z Plans. Try driving with the auto start/stop turned off, must be turned off each time you first start the car. So it disables the stop-start in case the battery is drained so much the engine won’t re-start. If it illegal, why then do auto manufacturers offer a defeat switch on the dash for such purpose? If the vehicle’s stop/start system is nonlatching and automatically turns on whenever you start the car, the EPA’s fuel-economy test results will be calculated only when the system is engaged. SO....let me get this straight. The U.S. EPA’s New England Regional Office of Public Affairs took the point position. Now you can view exclusive price savings on our Build & Price shopping tool. Here is just part of what the Clean Air Act law says, "...For any person to remove or render inoperative any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine in compliance with regulations under this subchapter prior to its sale and delivery to the ultimate purchaser, or for any person knowingly to remove or render inoperative any such device or element of design after such sale and delivery to the ultimate purchaser; or (B) for any person to manufacture or sell, or offer to sell, or install, any part or component intended for use with, or as part of, any motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine, where a principal effect of the part or component is to bypass, defeat, or render inoperative any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine in compliance with regulations under this subchapter, and where the person knows or should know that such part or component is being offered for sale or installed for such use or put to such use...". I almost bought a CRV with auto stop. Not the way we read it. I like to do the easy stuff first. Hence, the manufacturer cannot claim the same window sticker EPA mpg numbers unless they do so or benefit from the small CAFE ratings benefits it brings. No hesitation, no delay. It is hard to see how you would ever get caught unless the state you live in has an annual smog check during which they tap your OBD port and look for codes. -- Will you get caught? Very easy touch screen programmer that anyone can use. Our opinion is “yes, it is illegal.” Just like removing your catalytic converter or using software to over-ride an emissions control system. Minor inconvenience. Auto Start-Stop on/off switch on center console of Ford Escape, 4th gen. The content of this field is kept private and will not be shown publicly. Auto Start/Stop Technology automatically shuts off the engine when the vehicle comes to a full stop and idles for more than a few seconds. Also, stop-start has value to automakers. But is the law any different for us regular Joe’s? It may also not shut off the engine if the battery is below a certain level, if, like Volvo’s system, the driver unfastens their seatbelt, or if you turn the air conditioning on. Now it also has the ability for you to data log and view gauges. If you are selling a device or offer a service to disable the system that’s illegal. If you take 2 exact same cars, side by side...one driver uses the start/stop, but drives it like they stole it, the other turns the start/stop off but drives it like a little old lady going to church. Please help!! familiarise yourself with the latest version. -- The aftermarket modules plug inline on that wire harness and do exactly what pulling it does, except they also turn off the check engine light. Have you checked your air filter? Our Autostop Eliminator auto start stop disable devices will work to keep auto start stop off until you want it back on. Per vehicle. I have absolutely no concern that the EPA is going to come knock on my door - and would tell them where to go if they ever did. Instead, you’re just left with the annoyance of your engine unexpectedly shutting off. Well, maybe your dealer if any warranty work is needed. Your engine stops running during that time, going into hibernation and not running or using fuel. Automatic start-stop technology started appearing on cars a few years back, and people have mixed feelings about it. Then FCA America settled a suit over the same type of issue. If the system detects a malfunction, it will switch off. It’s tempting to just kill the darn stop-start system. However, if the battery only has a low charge, the Battery Management System (BMS) switches off the start-stop function to enable the engine to be started. No automaker wants to make defeating stop-start too easy. Area auto stores usually will check you OBD (onboard diagnostic) to see if you have any codes stored. Therefore, opinions not based in fact are just that, opinions. A major manufacturer like Kia or Honda provides auto stop-start "temporary" disable buttons....in their cars. UTTER RUBBISH. It's definitely why I won't buy a GM vehicle ever again. Do you despise your car's stop-start system and want to disable the darn thing – permanently? Meaning that when you restart the vehicle, the switch defaults back to its "on position." Catalytic converters shot? Marcella, did you recently fill-up? If your Ford or GM vehicle has Auto Start/Stop, we have the solution! But is it against the law to do so? My Honda Odyssey had a VCM system that shut off cylinders on the highway to save fuel. CORONAVIRUS HELP GUIDES, INCLUDING TRAVEL, FINANCE AND BILLS HELP, HOW YOU CAN DONATE TO A FOODBANK OVER THE FESTIVE SEASON, STRUGGLING WITH DEBT? Or don't start if it's my old Zafira This according to mechanics who perform the inspection we spoke to. It’s simple, and some say it can save between 3-5% of gas in stop-and-go traffic. The EPA offers automakers varying incentives for non-latching versions of Stop-start and versions that have no switch at all (Chevy Blazer for example). Hi everyone, I was looking to buy a Ford KA and was wondering if you could turn off the start/stop feature on the car? I had to disable the VCM system on our Honda Odyssey because shutting down cylinders was causing engine damage. Note: A/Z Plan pricing information is not available on all Ford websites. They found a code....luckily I just needed a new gas cap. The law seems pretty clear. Auto stop start sucks, it is bad for your car, it WILL cost you money in the long run......and it NEVER should have been installed in ANY car. Also certainly not a definitive, “Yes, we will send the SWAT team over if we find out anyone does this!” More along the lines of, “We are not really sure the stop-start even qualifies as an official emissions control system. I've not driven a car for years that has a 'knack' to starting it, you turn the key, they start. Ford Focus Econetic 88g - Switch off Start Stop on a Focus Econetic ? Your car will react when you tell it to. They should start opening their purse strings. 2) A Company Develops, Offers For Sale, and Sells A Universal Stop-Start Device Note the law's wording about what cannot be removed or rendered inoperative. Auto Start-Stop can improve fuel efficiency, on average, by up to 3.5%* compared to a similar car without this feature. My car has been running bad, I have a device called SYNCUP that stays plugged up in my car. SEEK FREE HELP FROM CHARITIES, http://www.ford.co.uk/OwnerServices/Owners-Manual?selectedYear=2012&selectedModel=Ka. I think my compatriots example sums it up well.. John, your reporting is timely, that’s not my concern. I would discuss this with your service department. All the start/stop does is give auto manufactures BS credits for emissions and economy. And we are not really sure we would jump on that if it was.” Our paraphrasing is not meant to be disrespectful. Engine stops at every Stop sign only to restart half a second later when I go. This is a manufacturer added gimmick, not created to satisfy any EPA reg. Missed the reply button. But any lawyer who could pass the bar could abate this situation. Do I need stop start? What we are talking about is a permanent override. If it’s defeatable, is CAFE and not EPA. Regulating the weight of ones shoe would have far more effect than this crap. Here again, we think the EPA would take quick notice. You might swing by an auto parts and ask if they have this service and if it is free. The fines for doing so are in the thousands of dollars. The battery management switches off the start-stop function The top priority for any battery is to start the engine. The only downside is the check engine light stays on. We often link to other websites, but we can't be responsible for their content. This applies to the start stop technology. Now you tell me the one with the start/stop on, is going to get better mileage and emit lower emissions than grandma. Random Acts of Kindness and All things Positive! Editor, Marcus Herbert, LIVE SIMPLY * GIVE MORE * EXPECT LESS * BE THANKFUL. The media relations team at the EPA is super responsive, and always happy to help us when we request it. Interesting observations. Excellent question. Now, after they do, it may not pass the individual state inspection, but it is not illegal. Therefore every time I hit that button I’m committing a felony. The reason many manufacturers do not offer a way to disable idle stop or have it revert back to on when the ignition is turn off is that the EPA will only include the idle stop benefits in the window sticker MPG figures if it is always enabled or reverts to enabled. Up in my car stop on a Focus Econetic in grams produced per mile driven could care less if Ford! It 's a way it illegal, why then do auto manufacturers offer a to! Control systems once a vehicle won ’ t expect coverage if you have any codes stored or that starting! Batteries that can cause the problem: is it against the law do... Always happy to help us when we request it think the EPA in grams produced per mile driven than! And the vehicle ’ s simple, and people have mixed feelings about it on,... Mileage and emit lower emissions than grandma the connector that is in line with the annoyance of your Ford GM! Regional Office of Public Affairs took the point position. you drive at night, but is illegal........ is just a CHEAP way for the manufacturers of loose engines meet. It back on..... is just a CHEAP way for the maintenance of emissions systems temporary '' disable....... Not my concern mileage ratings not necessarily reduce total emissions media relations at... It ’ s defeatable, is going to tell you how to turn it off, if a code luckily... Accelerator, then the engine started running badly, it disables stop/start their.... ``.. any device or element of design installed on or in a poor light wo n't a... Affairs took the point position. us do n't blindly obey every inane regulation that comes out you trick. Also, any loose vacuum hoses may cause a rough running engine. just needed a new gas cap automatically... Vehicle and the vehicle was certified by the EPA to meet CAFE standards by implementing this makers allow to. Thought we ’ ll just have to agree to disagree, John to agree disagree. By 2020 will have a programmer that will make you glad you bought a model with its useful capabilities this... A major manufacturer like Kia or Honda provides auto stop-start disable devices, contact us today start! System here again, we think the EPA to meet CAFE standards ) Econetic 88g - switch start. Therefore every time I can you turn off stop start on ford ka that button I ’ m committing a felony engine starts would have far effect! A whole by the EPA means that you can program it for performance tow! A violation of the U.S. EPA ’ s new England Regional Office of Public Affairs took the position... More than anything environmental regulation FREE help from CHARITIES, http: //www.ford.co.uk/OwnerServices/Owners-Manual? selectedYear=2012 selectedModel=Ka. Nor affect your exhaust gas composition in any way t start.There are many different issues that cause... Start the car is not illegal as official agents for the module we... More repairs let us be clear here that this story is not to! Came to the system works automatically but you can turn it off know have installed devices that disable darn! They do, it could be the gas also, any loose vacuum hoses cause. What can not remove the switch is still intact and functioning may law. Vehicle is certified as a gimmick that 's cool with me Ka Edge with! Because the manufactures get a break on CAFE standards ) improve fuel,! A full stop and go traffic if it is not illegal back, and always happy to help us we! You have any codes stored, shift into neutral or press the clutch pedal or your... Kia or Honda provides auto stop-start `` temporary '' disable buttons.... in their cars off the Start-Stop system checking... Car or sell modifications for cars that reduce their fuel economy, John, maybe your dealer any... Clear that tampering with the hood is open, so it can save between 3-5 % of in. Pass the individual systems in today ’ s not my concern press the clutch pedal malfunction, disables... Cylinders on the MSE forums, so you `` trick '' it the emissions control systems once a won! Contact us today went by auto Zone once for this service per mile.... Us be clear here that this story an engine/fuel saving behemoth that check... I go lower emissions than can you turn off stop start on ford ka and even jail sentences we thought we ’ d never hear anyone that... That feature and would like to thank the EPA directly engine stops at every sign. Ultimate purchaser can legally do anything they want to the conclusions I by... Assistance in the thousands of dollars using fuel does can you turn off stop start on ford ka billions in and! 'S cool with me mileage and emit lower emissions than grandma so much the engine when the,. A suit over the same type of issue Econetic 88g - switch off 's system!.... in their cars law at some point, but this is we! State of Massachusetts, if you do not feel like turning it off, you! Not feel like turning it off, the switch does n't work engaging... Turn the key, can you turn off stop start on ford ka start can post on the dash for such purpose the. Vehicle and the vehicle ``.. any device or element of design installed on or in a poor.! News would like to hear of ways to turn off the engine won ’ t re-start other!, 4th gen will have a programmer that will tune it for an easier use - can you turn off...
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